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Anon
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changes to message boards.......

just noticed that there has been a few changes to the forum......

mainly in the how to use this message board.......

as a new member im reading all posts......

this morning there was only 7 sub topics but now there are 8

(All posts on the message forum become the property of the Bedford CF club. By posting on the forum you authorise us to make back-ups of your posts and to re-post any posts at a future time if required)

this posting has been put up today...........by??

surly if you want this to happen then you need to have a new section on your membership section where you can tick to agree to this.........


also im interested in wild camping but cant find that section now .....

another section that seams to have gone is height restrictions .......
surly this is an important factor when visiting places ..


why has this club stopped holding authorised rallies and meets??


almost all of the other clubs I belong to hold rallies and meets all over the
country and are endorsed as their club...........

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Sun 22 Jul 2012 @ 18:53 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Colin Birch
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Custom John wrote:
just noticed that there has been a few changes to the forum......

mainly in the how to use this message board.......

as a new member im reading all posts......

this morning there was only 7 sub topics but now there are 8

(All posts on the message forum become the property of the Bedford CF club. By posting on the forum you authorise us to make back-ups of your posts and to re-post any posts at a future time if required)

this posting has been put up today...........by??


I added this. Basically it's to allow me to keep regular back-ups of all data on the site. Should a major server crash occur I can restore the site or individual posts without having to contact the original author for permission first. Also should the site be hacked and posts altered/deleted I can re-post without problems.

Custom John wrote:
surly if you want this to happen then you need to have a new section on your membership section where you can tick to agree to this.........

Rules and regs of the site can be updated at any time. As author of the forum software if I decide to implement a new function would I would need to ask everyones permission before adding the function? What if one person complains? The whole site looses out.


Custom John wrote:
also im interested in wild camping but cant find that section now .....

This section hadn't been used for a very long time. It was way out of date and it was thought better to remove it rather than leave out of date information online that no one used.

Custom John wrote:
another section that seams to have gone is height restrictions .......
surly this is an important factor when visiting places ..

As above. This section had not been used for quite some time.

Custom John wrote:
why has this club stopped holding authorised rallies and meets??

almost all of the other clubs I belong to hold rallies and meets all over the
country and are endorsed as their club...........

Most of the meets are basically 'wild camps' and our liability insurance did not cover this. Also most of the meets have fires/BBQs which are specifically excluded from the insurance. If someone was to be hurt or injured while at one of these meets the club could not afford the claim against it. Unfortunately we now live in a 'claim society' and because of this meets are no longer classed as official. If the meets are held on official camp sites and no fires etc are allowed then maybe we could back the meet



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Colin Birch - CF-UK Admin
Pontypridd, S.Wales
The Bedford CF Web Site
http://www.cf-uk.co.uk

Sun 22 Jul 2012 @ 20:07 View Colin Birch   Email Colin Birch   Colin Birch Home Page   Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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All posts on the message forum become the property of the Bedford CF club. By posting on the forum you authorise us to make back-ups of your posts and to re-post any posts at a future time if required.

As it stands this condition of use is so general and all-encompassing that it could be invoked for other purposes, even outright theft of intellectual property. If the reason for the condition of use is to keep regular back-ups of all data on the site etc., all well and good in my view, then perhaps it would be better to reformulate the condition accordingly.

Rules and regs of the site can be updated at any time. As author of the forum software if I decide to implement a new function would I would need to ask everyones permission before adding the function? What if one person complains? The whole site looses out.

Again, all well and good but not relevant to a significant change in conditions of use, a change that requires an accept/decline option as John suggests in order to avoid getting into very hot water. Moreover, given the wide reaching nature of the change, perhaps it would be better to announce it as such rather than quietly tack it on to an existing post so that everyone would be aware of the change.

Most of the meets are basically 'wild camps' and our liability insurance did not cover this.

Maybe all these meets should be in a 'Wild Camping' section ...

Also most of the meets have fires/BBQs which are specifically excluded from the insurance. If someone was to be hurt or injured while at one of these meets the club could not afford the claim against it. Unfortunately we now live in a 'claim society' and because of this meets are no longer classed as official. If the meets are held on official camp sites and no fires etc are allowed then maybe we could back the meet

This raises a number of questions.

1. If there are no official club meets then how can club Public Liability Insurance have any effect?

2. If the club Public Liability Insurance excludes fires/BBQs then is it worth having given that most meets have one or the other, some both?

3. What are the criteria for meets to be backed by the club to become 'official'?

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Mon 23 Jul 2012 @ 20:25 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Colin Birch
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First can I apologise for any slow posting. I'm away from home with very little signal on my mobile internet. The signal comes and goes so I could end up replying to this and then be unable to send it

philbradshaw wrote:
As it stands this condition of use is so general and all-encompassing that it could be invoked for other purposes, even outright theft of intellectual property. If the reason for the condition of use is to keep regular back-ups of all data on the site etc., all well and good in my view, then perhaps it would be better to reformulate the condition accordingly.

Currently all it's for is to back up the site. As you know posts have gone missing. If this happens a full back up should be available to re-instate any posts that have been deleted accidentaly or otherwise

philbradshaw wrote:
Again, all well and good but not relevant to a significant change in conditions of use, a change that requires an accept/decline option as John suggests in order to avoid getting into very hot water. Moreover, given the wide reaching nature of the change, perhaps it would be better to announce it as such rather than quietly tack it on to an existing post so that everyone would be aware of the change.

Can I just point out to members that custom john IS NOT who he says he is. It is a member who is hideing behind the alias of custom john and their sole intention is to cause trouble. The member WILL be named and shamed at a time that suits ME and not custom john. I'll play along with 'john' for now as it seems to suit me at the moment

philbradshaw wrote:
Maybe all these meets should be in a 'Wild Camping' section ...

Maybe!

philbradshaw wrote:
This raises a number of questions.

1. If there are no official club meets then how can club Public Liability Insurance have any effect?

It no longer can

philbradshaw wrote:
2. If the club Public Liability Insurance excludes fires/BBQs then is it worth having given that most meets have one or the other, some both?

No it's not. The liability insurance was taken out because certain members, yourself included, insisted that they couldn't hold meets without it. Having discussed the insurance with committee members of other clubs and the possible legal outcomes it was decided that unless we could afford very expensive liability insurance the risks involved and possible financial risks should an uninsured accident occur, club organised meets are no longer viable.

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Colin Birch - CF-UK Admin
Pontypridd, S.Wales
The Bedford CF Web Site
http://www.cf-uk.co.uk

Mon 23 Jul 2012 @ 23:02 View Colin Birch   Email Colin Birch   Colin Birch Home Page   Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Currently all it's for is to back up the site.

Fair enough if it is only to cater for things like a major server crash or the site being hacked and posts altered/deleted. However, until the conditions are written so as to make this clear the door is open to abuse such as members being prevented from altering or deleting their own posts commensurate with these functions being an established part of the form.

Can I just point out to members that custom john IS NOT who he says he is.

Maybe so; doesn't answer the question of why such a significant change was quietly tacked on to an existing post rather than announced separately so that everyone would be aware of it as new conditons of use. Absence of ready answer allows suspicion of an alternative agenda such as preventing members who leave, or are turfed out, from taking with them what rightly belongs to them.

The new conditions of use likely won't affect most members because what they may value as their own will be hosted externally and they will be free to remove it as they see fit. In such circumstances the clause 'All posts on the message forum become the property of the Bedford CF club' has little effect other than to retain text portion of posts. However, this clause together with 'By posting on the forum you authorise us to make back-ups of your posts and to re-post any posts at a future time if required' takes on a different light in my case because much of the content of my posts resides on the CF-UK server in order to avoid problems with external hosting.

Previously I have had no qualms about this but now there is room for suspicion and, bearing in mind the generality of the new conditions, I am drawn to consider the possibility my being turfed out on some pretext and denied access to the server to remove what rightfully is mine. Taken in conjunction with unsatisfactory explanations for strange happenings that I have experienced recently this is not as far fetched as it may seem.

Accordingly I refuse to accept the new conditions of use and, to avoid unpleasantness of having to go to law to protect my rights and obtain appropriate compensation, I have removed all my work from the club server, such work in any event pre-dating introduction of such conditions. I will re-instate everything once I have an unequivocal undertaking that I retain all rights to my intellectual property. In the meantime I rescind all agreements with respect to my work and revoke all licence to use any part including back-up or other copy without prior permission.

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Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 11:16 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Thats quite a statement made Phil,so in your assumption there is some sort of conspiricy going on to oust you from CF-UK,makes good reading for our members,i nor do the others wish to see you turfed out as you so eloquently put,we have great respect for yourself in the way you undertake to answer questions on here for the members,i am deeply offended by your insinuation,and
would like an apology forthwith.
Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 12:26 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Colin Birch
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Some bloody family holiday I'm having! I'm supposed to be enjoying two weeks off in Somerset with my family and so far I've spent every day on here dealing with problems.

philbradshaw wrote:
Previously I have had no qualms about this but now there is room for suspicion and, bearing in mind the generality of the new conditions, I am drawn to consider the possibility my being turfed out on some pretext and denied access to the server to remove what rightfully is mine. Taken in conjunction with unsatisfactory explanations for strange happenings that I have experienced recently this is not as far fetched as it may seem.

First of all there are no plans of 'turfing you out'. Why should there be? Your area is a useful addition to the site and it needs you to keep it up to date and to keep it going. Yes I know a post or two of yours has been deleted. None of the admin team did this. The best person to ask about this is 'Custom John'. I did want to keep this out of the public eye as it can create panic amongst members but 'Custom John' found a loop hole on the site which allowed access to the 'CF Admin' user account and full admin privileges such as editing/deleting messages without being the author of the thread/post. This vulnerability has been plugged and 'Custom John' no longer has access any admin functions. I'll just point out that at no time did 'Custom John' have access to any personal info such as passwords.

philbradshaw wrote:
Accordingly I refuse to accept the new conditions of use and, to avoid unpleasantness of having to go to law to protect my rights and obtain appropriate compensation, I have removed all my work from the club server

That is entirely up to you. If you want to remove all your work you can. Myself and the Admin team can have no influence on you as to what you want to do with your work. I'm just upset that you feel this way about the admin team and the fact that you couldn't have discussed this with us in private (The Admin and Mods area would have been perfect) before bringing everything out in public.

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Colin Birch - CF-UK Admin
Pontypridd, S.Wales
The Bedford CF Web Site
http://www.cf-uk.co.uk

Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 14:38 View Colin Birch   Email Colin Birch   Colin Birch Home Page   Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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This is getting very heavy. Problems with members accessing restricted areas should mean an instant removal of their membership from this club.

This club is here to help fellow members with a love of the Bedford CF, for meets, exchanges of ideas and most importantly, technical advice on a very obsolete piece of machinery.

I am here to learn, to get tips and advice, and where posible, to help others.
I'm sure other members are here for the same reason.

Personal egos, for whatever reason, are out of place here. If you want to help others, then stay, if all you want to do is to disrupt this site then go, there are enough problems in this world, we do not need such problems here, this is a hobby and is supposed to be fun ( albeit expensive fun )!

Martin
Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 20:10 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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I agree, apart from talking about obsolete machinery. Mines fine. The Doc said so. Like most folk on the site, mine is a leisure/ hobby/ passion/ holiday/ source of amusement and/or frustration/satisfaction.
I could be talking about one of two things, or even both.
Depends how your mind works.

For the sake of brevity, could I ask that admin discuss the events in question in private, possibly delete this thread and allow us plebs members to enjoy the fun we joined the club for.

And anyone who doesnt want to have fun can off...

I think Ive just made the magic censor simley appear. If not, Ive ed up.

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Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 21:04 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Put the brakes on everybody.they might be drum but they will at least slow things down lol.I might not post much but i am always here lurking in the background and it seems to me this has the potential to go a bit ott.I am not sure quiete what is happening but it is not good for the site and therefore the members who enjoy being on here enjoying what is normally a brilliant atmosphere of camaraderie and fun and an absolute fountain of knowlege on the cf.It would be great if everyone took a great big breath in and said 1..2..3.. lol.Speak in haste,repent at lesiure.That is all and forgive the spelling lol.

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Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 22:05 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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As a member of the Admin team,i personnally would have liked this to have been discussed in the admin/mod section first,but for what ever reason,Phil chose not to do this.
Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 22:27 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Knowledge.

This is directed at PhilBradshaw.

Phil, you are a fountain of knowledge regarding CF's. Your posts on this site have helped many, many, members to repair/modify their CF's to keep them going and help preserve the marque. Please do not get bogged down with technicalities regarding information. Sharing knowledge is a wonderful gift, and you have an ability to describe details of information in such clarity that if you chose to leave, will undoubtedly leave a gaping hole in this site.

It would appear that this is what was intended by a certain member, by unofficially removing posts and threads.

We must thank Colin that there is a CF/UK; other than helping to preserve this fabulous vehicle, his administration over the years has helped this Club to expand the membership to what it is today.

So can we now all move on and worry about passing the next MOT, and not fight each other!

Time for a brew!

Martin
Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 22:40 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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As much as i`d agree Martin,i do not wish to be accused of a conspiricy to oust Mr Bradshaw from the site.Now we had a similar problem with a past member not long ago,attacking admin in a public forum, we came under fire for not informing all members of that situation,so this in a way has solved that problem as its for all too see,so i have to ask is it fair to treat Mr Bradshaw any differently,as past said member had similar qualities and experience of fixing CF`s,even with titles we are all members and have to adhere to the rules,no-one is immune.
Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 22:55 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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My intention was to get Phil to reconsider his position on this site, nothing more. Yes, you are right, we've been here and done this only a few weeks ago with another member. It's now becoming a bit tedious, ego's seem to be dominating with what should be fun and a hobby.

This is a site for like minded individuals to enjoy and share their love ( or hatred ) of Beddies.

Over the years, having been on many committees, I have seen so much damage caused by the few, to the detriment of the many. In the end everyone loses out if sanity is not restored.

Why is it that when something is going well, someone wants to destroy it?

Why should Admin want to remove anyone who contributes positively to this site?

Why do people see conspiracies?

This is a site for Bedford CF lovers, not MI5 or the CIA, please lets return to the world of track rod ends and diff ratios.

THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE FUN!!!!!!

CAN WE PLEASE MOVE ON?

Martin

Thu 26 Jul 2012 @ 23:25 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Alex Mac wrote:
Thats quite a statement made Phil,so in your assumption there is some sort of conspiricy going on to oust you from CF-UK,makes good reading for our members,i nor do the others wish to see you turfed out.

That was said then.
Dave

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Fri 27 Jul 2012 @ 08:27 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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OMG what's going off??? I've not had chance to read all the threads recently and for some reason I missed all this thread so only started reading it now. No one should be ousted from this club - why are people turning against those who are trying to help each other - I'm really shocked and angry actually Not sure what has happened behind the scenes but can everyone just come back, including Gethin and lets just carry one enjoying our vans !!!

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Fri 27 Jul 2012 @ 08:39 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Alex Mac wrote:
Now we had a similar problem with a past member not long ago,attacking admin in a public forum, we came under fire for not informing all members of that situation,so this in a way has solved that problem as its for all too see.


In my opinion this is a site for CF members and as CF members we all have the right to know whats going on.

Alex Mac wrote
so i have to ask is it fair to treat Mr Bradshaw any differently,as past said member had similar qualities and experience of fixing CF`s,even with titles we are all members and have to adhere to the rules,no-one is immune.


You said previously that you didn't want to oust Phil Bradshaw it doesn't seem like that now dose it?.
Phil Bradshaw is one of the most valued members of the CF club with a vast knowledge of CFs to loose him would be a disaster and a great loss to the CF club.
Dave

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Fri 27 Jul 2012 @ 08:56 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
Anon
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Dave wrote-

"You said previously that you didn't want to oust Phil Bradshaw it doesn't seem like that now dose it?.
Phil Bradshaw is one of the most valued members of the CF club with a vast knowledge of CFs to loose him would be a disaster and a great loss to the CF club.
Dave"

Let me have my say now------

Did I say i wanted him out,no,but he has too accept he was wrong,he made it clear that in his view,Colin stole his data,and we conspired to oust him from the site,his info is valuable,yes,but not all from his own head, unfortunatly 1 man isn`t the be all and end all of this site,He knew exactly what he was doing by posting his comments on here,when he had the opportunity to post in the admin/mod section first,he wanted the Admin team to come under fire for something we had done in his head,not an actual occurance,he`s doing a good job eh!,he hasn`t commented since he started this ,but been on and read,the site was fine before he came along,and will be if HE leaves by his OWN accord not OURS,he does well from this site,financially,he`s had help keeping his van on the road,help towards the cost of meets etc,HAS HIS OWN SECTIONS ON HERE,A MODERATOR,so now do you think he`s being unfairly treated ,i don`t think so,but we are by him.
Fri 27 Jul 2012 @ 10:10 Edit this messageQuote this messagePMQuote this message
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